LEVEL-5 IS PURE NIGHTMARE FUEL

Professor Layton thirty day challenge 4

4. A character you used to love but now hate

Clive Dove

Before you start throwing stuff at me and booing let me explain. I get why Clive Dove did what he did, his parents got caught in an explosion caused by Bill Hawks corruption and I sympathise with that, but he didn’t had to make an overcomplicated plan and drag innocent bystanders into this mess and just simply just assassinate during the whole time machine event during his speech and bring the country into total chaos.

A bit off topic, but Clive Dove’s motivation and the grand scheme of his plan is basically a prototype version of Ren Hiyama (Spoilers for Danball Senki) I suck at explaining things but the here I go

Unlike Clive, Ren actually killed Yoshimitsu Kaidou and replaced him with an android to further his agenda
Ren’s plan is like Clive’s but in a much wider scale is that he wants to bomb the World Leaders in N-city during a meeting with a rocket ship and when it hits, the explosion will cause the world wide blackout and it will be humanity’s last chance to get crap together and become better people
Oh and both of them have parents murdered due to corrupt people climbing the political ladder (Clive’s parents, Ren’s dad)

I know I skimmed through a couple a details but I just want to get to my point, and I think the Climax in Danball Senki is handled better than the one in Unwound Future, and that is because Ban and his gang actually stopped Ren’s plan from going too far and before the rocket ship exploded he decided to stay on the ship and commit suicide in order to redeem himself because he knows that history will paint him in a negative light. (correct me with I’m wrong)

Honesty I wouldn’t have that much of a problem with Clive and his plan with Layton was able to stop Clive’s fortress from risen above the fake future London. but it was to late and Clive decided to shoot cannons all over London and drag innocent Man, Women, and Children to their possible graves (I want it to be a No Endor Massacre kind of deal but that’s me being optimistic), even though I’m glad hes atoning to his crimes but sometimes I wonder if there is real life people who actually did that despite well what Clive did.

TLDR: I don’t really hate Clive, I just don’t like his groupies who says that Clive didn’t do nothing and freak out when people say they don’t like him and thinks three not aloud to express their love to him, and picking on other villains and saying they are worse than him because reasons

yay word salads

Except for the first two icons and Human Komasan, here are the Professor Layton icons from wibble wobble in Japan 9not released in English yet)

Happy holidays from the Layton gang

Some random Layton artwork for level 5s roid service

Clive’s Mobile Fortress certainly looks like it came from the scraps of metal slug vehicles

Clive’s original hat design in Unwound Future

kaileyfox:

I feel Clive is a controversial character in the PL fandom, and, correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe this is due to his role as an antagonist and his actions while playing this role. As a writer, I want to make it clear that an antagonist isn’t always the embodiment of sheer evil and shouldn’t be seen in such a black and white manner. Take L/UF itself for example. The prime minister, as many fans will know, is an antagonist himself, though the game doesn’t blatantly acknowledge this, and he is a truly evil antagonist at that. He destroyed lives, and for very selfish reasons–money, fame, power, and influence. Now, consider Clive. Yes, he too is an antagonist. He destroyed, killed, etc. But one thing separates his antagonism from the prime minister’s: His goal. Clive didn’t want money, fame, power, or influence. He wanted to rebuild London and govern it with competent leaders so those who had suffered as he had, and those whom he suspected would continue to suffer, would be able to finally live in peace. I’ve explained the psychology behind Clive’s character quite a few times in other posts, but due to his trauma and what fed it–the distraught people he interviewed and the horrible events he witnessed while working as a reporter–he actually believed he had to go to such lengths as razing an entire city before he could truly create a brighter future. His goals were horribly misguided by his mental state, but they were unselfish. He was thinking of others, not simply himself, as the prime minister had.
Also important to note, and perhaps most vital, is that a character’s actions don’t always define the entirety of that character. Yes, Clive killed and destroyed, but, this was merely a piece of who he was. As canonically stated by Spring and Cogg, Clive was always so gentle and kind. He had a good heart. And this is also supported by what he says at the end of the game. His true intention was never to harm anyone or anything, but to save London from the grim future he believed it was headed toward, as mentioned above.
All this to say, if you want to like Clive, go ahead and like him. He is a truly phenomenal character with a phenomenal background if you dig as hard as I have to uncover it, and his label as an antagonist as well as his misguided actions that make up only a piece of his character should not stop you from enjoying his whole character.

Nice little explanation my friend, but i’m afraid that CLives goals are far less honorable, he did not state that he wanted to start London anew and save it from some sort of government conspiracy he simply wanted revenge from the government that took his parents away and maybe even London as a whole for being duped from Bill Hawkes liles.

There is another part of Clives psyche that people should take to account, that Clive is a pseudocommando Mass Murderer. Let me explain, he planned the whole thing in great detail and he used a heatran with a tower of cannons on his back, hinting he might have a slight interest in weapons and he successfully played god to those kidnapped scientist into building said weapon and even tricking Dimitri Allen to think there actually building a time machine, not to mention that his main motivation is revenge on British society as a whole and his anti-government ideologies.

So in a nutshell Clive wanted London to remember him for his crime, his power over anyone trying to stop him and spreading terror amongst the British populace, In Fact if he didn’t toy with Layton and eventually bonded with him he would’ve committed suicide inside his fortress, blowing up or otherwise (and don’t worry about fearing to like him, he has a lot of groupies)

kaileyfox:

professsorlayton:
Flora is 18, in the curious village it was stated that she was “blossoming into adulthood.” If not 18, she was at least 17. Clive on the other hand must have been in his very early twenties, 20-22 at the most. He was probably only 10 when his parents died, give or take a couple years. Their relationship is most definitely plausible and hardly child abuse.
You seem to be missing the bulk of the OP’s argument. Whether Flora was close to the same age as Clive or not is hardly the problem. The problem is that Clive was psychotic. That should not have to be explained, but I’ll repeat it for the OP anyway: Clive spent years ruminating on how to manipulate Layton, and then proceeded to do so without remorse until he finally snapped. He kidnapped the prime minister. He tried to destroy an entire metropolis. He killed people. If that’s not enough, (and it really should be) he kidnapped Flora, obviously against her will. If the two ever actually entered into a romantic relationship during this time, you can bet there would be not child abuse, but domestic abuse–emotional, psychological, mental, you name it. Clive was controlling, narcissistic. He couldn’t have cared less about people’s emotions, so long as his plans for revenge succeeded. Yet, people continue to ship Flora and Clive in a L/UF setting as if Clive was a completely sane individual.
The only time the ship should be defended is if it’s set in an AU, or when the two are much older and Clive has gone through some extensive therapy. Because as someone with a psychology degree, I can tell you Clive would not be able to handle a healthy platonic relationship, let alone a romantic one, for a long time, and if people continue to ship Clive in Flora in this way, they’re, in turn, supporting abusive relationships. It’s an issue.

Plus not to sound like a SJW, it’s that Floras kidnapping is utterly pointless as Layton already has enough motivation to stop Clive and I bet the reason why Clive is not as vilified in the fandom is because Bill Hawks is a psychopath

Face it, if Clive did that kind of crap on the wrong state of America he will get the death penalty

Yes, all I need is the Eternal Diva set then my cell phone strap collection will be complete (the two Laytons are hard to tell apart but one has his finger pointing the other is more open handed) don’t worry Zillabean I still have the Flora one I bought with me (it’s in its original gastopon pod with my other Luke)

What Clive thinks he is during Unwound Future

kaileyfox:

All right, I’m in a speak-my-mind kind of mood tonight, so here’s my two cents on this.
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I understand where your coming from, where Clive comes from and I sympathize with him, but if he is willing to kill ever man, women, and CHILDREN just for the sake for his own justice, I can’t emphasize with him one bit

I mean he could of simply

Assassinate Hawks for all of England to see and chaos ensues or
Kidnapped Hawks, make a grand speech for everyone to see and raddled off any corruption Bill did before and during his reign and let the crowed want justice

As a matter of fact we don’t even know if Bill did awful things since that explosion, I mean London is a nice place to live as far the eye can see so that means he did a pretty good job running the country, we don’t know what jolly old England was like before he came to power, to put it lightly “the ends justify the means”. Heck i can go even farther and say either Bill was a Puppet for some organization, or Bill was the mastermind who is smarter when we think, maybe the Bill throughout the game is not Bill at all but infact a body double or a robot duplicate and hes just sitting back in his office mocking his old friend for trying to get revenge on him

Or maybe my view of Clive is too black and white for my own good and letting the tin foil hat control my mind but i’m sleepy so i’m going to bed